VWMusic

All images courtesy of Robby Takac

By Andrew Daly
andrew@vinylwriter.com

No matter the medium or modicum, the duo of Robby Takac and John Rzeznik are unapologetically themselves.

Over 36 years, the bonded-via-music duo has held it together, guiding the Goo Goo Dolls to sky-high commercial success in the ’90s and navigating the uncertain waters of the music industry.

The last several years have proved fruitful and productive for Tackac and Rzeznik, having released four albums in six years, but the duo’s latest, Chaos in Bloom, may well be their best effort since their late ’90s heyday.

Recorded during the COVID-19 pandemic, Takac and Rzeznik retreated to the deep woods of Upstate New York, settling in behind the walls of a sleepy church. In the midst of social isolation, the duo chose to forgo a producer and have Rzeznik man the controls. The gamble paid off, as the sonic results of Chaos in Bloom are nothing short of astounding.

“Historically, we’ve had a tendency to burn producers out,” said Takac. “But the pandemic really offered us a different type of opportunity because now we didn’t have the option to go and fly around the country to work with five or six different producers. We were just going to go in and do what we were going to do, and I think that was a really fortunate thing for us.”

Comfortable in their own skin and settling in as elder statesmen, it seems that Takac and Rzeznik aren’t looking back. Instead, their gaze is fixed on the future, and if Chaos in Bloom is any indication, that future is bright.

“I think there was a process of change that was happening quickly; it didn’t happen through the process of erosion; it was sort of thrust upon us,” Takac recollected. “And I feel like the pandemic really thrust this situation upon us, and that change lent itself to the way that we made this record leading to exciting results. It could go either way, but I think there are some exciting results here bred from that scenario.”

Bassist Robby Takac recently dialed in via phone with me, recounting the challenges of recording a record during the pandemic, stepping out of the shadow of a storied past, and how the Goo Goo Dolls are forging a path onward and upward.

Andrew:
Starting with Chaos in Bloom, this record was written and recorded primarily over the lockdown; is that correct?

Robby:
Yeah, we are in the midst of a tour for a record that we put out in 2019 called Miracle Pill. We had done a run around the U.S. – a summer run – and then we went out to the U.K. But shortly after that, everything shut down, so we weren’t able to finish the process with that record because everything just stopped. So, as the tour kept getting canceled in the first year, John [Rzeznik] put together a Christmas record called It’s Christmas All Over so that kept us busy during that time. And when the tour got canceled again during the second year, we realized that we were in a position where it looked like we were going to have to do something. We knew that once things opened up again that we couldn’t just walk out with a two-year-old record and tour again.

So, we started to work on stuff, but you know, over the years – at least compared to the past – the process of making a record has changed a ton. And if I’m being honest, we tend to burn producers out; we had been using three, four, or even five producers on our records. It got to the point where we were doing like one song at a time, each with a different producer. But the pandemic forced us into a position where it was just us, so John decided that he was going to take over the production duties and oversee the whole thing. So, we went in as a band, set up an old church out in Woodstock, New York, and just started recording songs; basically, we had a bunch of demos, and we slowly started turning them into songs.

Andrew:
Would you say the choice to self-produce this record allowed the band to harken back to some of its early roots?

Yeah, for sure. It’s funny, though; I don’t know if that would have happened if it weren’t for the fact that we were living through a pandemic. If not for that, I think we may have just fallen right back into what we had always done. I think the pandemic really provided a unique opportunity for us to get back to some of the vibes that we were feeling all those years ago, so that was a little bit of a silver lining for us. We hadn’t made a record like this since we were kids; back when nobody cared about what we were doing, and that totally altered our approach. With the band being in a room every day playing music, I think it put us in a position to rediscover what this band is at its core, and I think that made it into the early stages of the songwriting. And I think it pulled the record more towards the sound of those earlier records that we used to make when we were just coming up.

Andrew:
What are some of the themes running through Chaos in Bloom?

Robby:
John mentioned in the studio that he was listening to The Charlatan’s records a lot at that time. He felt that there were a lot of lines on those albums that were fitting for the moment that we were living through, you know? Because when we were making the record, the vaccines weren’t even out yet, and most people were still cowering in their houses, so it was a weird time. I think a lot of those themes made it into the songwriting and are all throughout the album. And like I said earlier, I don’t think this record would have happened the way it did if it weren’t for the crazy situation that was thrust upon us. So, Chaos in Bloom, yeah, I think it’s a pretty fitting title for what the world was going through at that moment, not just us, but what everybody was collectively feeling at that moment.

Andrew:
What was your collective approach to songwriting, given the state of the world at the time?

Robby:
I guess it’s a mix. We tend to come up with our own ideas, and then we bring them in and start working on them together. But from the very beginning, it was a lot different this time without having producers involved because producers pull the project in one direction or another. So, I’ll walk in with these nuts of ideas, and then when John walks in, I’ll be like, “Hey, I’ve got these two chords that sound really cool. I think there’s a song in here somewhere,” and we’ll work on it from there. And if there is something there, we’ll find it, but if there’s a producer sitting there with you, then their input gets thrown in, so the band tends to get pulled in one direction or another. I think the purity of process as far as being a band, with the majority of what’s on this record, is pretty strong. Maybe the strongest it’s ever been.

Andrew:
I wanted to touch on “Save Me From Myself,” which I feel stands out. Take me through its genesis.

Robby:
That was a weird song to start because we had worked on it while we were in Woodstock, and it didn’t really have any lyrics or anything; it was a sort of musical piece. And Chris Szczech, our engineer, he had been working with a couple of female singers, and so John thought it would be nice to hear a female voice on the track. So, they sort of ran it through and tried out a couple of things, added the harmonies, and it turned out pretty cool.

Andrew:
How about your track “Past Mistakes?”

Robby:
Yeah, that’s one of the ones I sing. I’d say that’s probably the most straight-ahead rock song on the record. I love everything we do, but it feels good to do that sometimes. Every once in a while, I just like to pull out a rock song; the guitar tones at the beginning are pretty unique. I think that Brad [Fernquist] and John are pretty into the ’80s kind of thing, and that one is kind of throwback a little bit. It’s cool.

Andrew:
The last one I wanted to hit on is “Day After Day.” Can you recount its origins?

Robby:
Most of the songs on this record really came together in the same way, and “Day After Day” was sort of us looking back on the whole process of making this record. We would just get together in a room in the mornings and jam, and then we’d take a break and go eat breakfast. It was only us because, at that time, we were isolated from everybody else; I mean, we saw the lady down at the local diner in Woodstock, but that was it. [Laughs]. We were in the middle of the woods, so we would just get together every morning with our little pieces of music, these little pieces of demos, and we’d put things together. So, Craig [Macintyre] and I would basically play for hours and hours and hours until we finally pulled something together that sounded like an actual song. Once we had that, we could start putting some layering on top, and then John and Brad would get involved, so “Day After Day” came together that way.

Andrew:
You mentioned earlier that the Goo Goo Dolls have tended to burn out producers. What is it about your creative process that lends itself to that?

Robby:
It can be decoded in a lot of different ways; if you’re the producer, and you’re in the middle of the process, and you have a month to make a record, I guess it can be viewed as indecision. But I think myself and John view that as being able to explore our options; rightfully so. You know, a producer has to make a bunch of records every year to survive; they have to do that to have a career, right? But we don’t; we only have to make one every few years. So, that’s why we stopped using one producer on our records because they certainly didn’t have the time to do fourteen or whatever amount of songs with us.

Andrew:
Would you record a record this way again?

Robby:
I don’t know if we’ll do it again; I’m not really sure. We’ll see if we cross that bridge when we get to it, but during the sessions, we recorded another six of what I would say are usable songs. Besides what came out on Chaos in Bloom, there are still more that we held back; we didn’t really pick the ten songs that are on that record because we thought they were the best songs per se. As a matter of fact, the songs that are on the record weren’t really even finished when we picked them. We were just going for a vibe, and we felt these ten songs fit in with that. So, there are six more songs; we’re maybe halfway to having another album together already with that same feeling to it. I think doing it this way worked really well for us here, and maybe, we’re gonna pull the next one in the same direction; we’ll see.

Andrew:
Having already reached your commercial peak and armed with the knowledge that we live in a world where it’s hard to sell records, what are your hopes for Chaos in Bloom?

Robby:
Man, that’s tough. I don’t know. We look at it like we never know what’s gonna happen, but the objective is always to just get to the next day. This band’s been around for decades and decades now, and there’s been an ebb and flow through our career. If you go back, we had a streak of songs that probably started with “Iris” – arguably one of the biggest songs of all time – and it’s tough to get out of that shadow sometimes. But, you know, the sun’s fucking hot right now, and it’s nice to find some shade and to get out of the sun every once in a while, you know? I feel like that’s much more of a blessing than it is something that we have to worry about because we’ve been able to move on. And it’s been decades now since that song was released, and we’re continuing to produce great music, and we honestly feel like we’re continuing to grow as a band. We just moved forward, man, and we keep trying to make it to tomorrow. If we keep doing that and keep our band together, then that’s all that matters.

Andrew:
In the spirit of harkening back, I wanted to quickly touch on Superstar Car Wash, which is coming up on 30 years old. What are some of your most significant memories of the band’s major label debut?

Robby:
We did Hold Me Up, the one before Superstar Car Wash, with Armand John Petri, a friend we had worked with in Buffalo for a long time. And when Superstar Car Wash came about, Armand was still working with us, as we were doing all the demos and such. At that point, I’m not even sure we knew what label it would come out on because, at the time, we were still signed to Metal Blade Records, but we had gotten some interest from Warner Bros. and bigger producers and such. So, with Superstar Car Wash, that was the first record that we ever worked on outside of our hometown in Buffalo, NY. We went up to Ontario to record the drums up at Metalworks Studios with a producer named Gavin MacKillop, who had worked with Toad, the Wet Sprocket, The Church, and a bunch of bands that we really loved. So, there were a lot of firsts on that record because we had now fallen out of our comfort zone and moved into working in a different way with new and different people. I think, in that way, Superstar Car Wash was a product of the process change, and it was pretty quick.

Andrew:
After 36 years as a band, what do you attribute to Goo Goo Dolls’ longevity and continued success, Robby?

Robby:
I think it’s exactly what I said before; like, you’ve got to figure out how to get to tomorrow, you know? Sometimes that means recognizing that we had a great day yesterday, and we say, “Let’s have another one of those tomorrow.” It could also be us recognizing that today didn’t work out, and we go, “Let’s figure out what went wrong, and let’s get to it tomorrow.” And over time, you’ll have a whole series of those little victories and realizations, but can you keep it together? You can’t look too broadly at the situation; you just need to look at what it is and just keep your band together, man. I know it’s the simplest thing to say, but the easiest way to keep your band together is not to break up; you’ve got to figure out how to do that, right? It’s a lot of chemistry, a lot of figuring out the mathematical equations with people’s personalities, needs, desires, creative wants, all those things. The best I can say is we pay attention to those things, and we always seem to make it to the next day.

– Andrew Daly (@vwmusicrocks) is the Editor-in-Chief for www.vwmusicrocks.com and may be reached at andrew@vinylwriter.com